joharmenezes
Member
Hi, I am just curious to know what kind of jobs (other than software development) require one to have knowledge of advanced concepts in excel like VBA, macros, SQL, etc?
Thanks
Thanks
What kind of jobs require advanced excel knowledge?
- Thread starter joharmenezes
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Joharmenezes
I am going to answer this with two answers, None and All
No Jobs require you to have advanced Excel skills
Excel is but a tool to an end and being able to use the tool well maybe with "Advanced Excel Skills" as you refer to them, simply means you can do your job more efficiently/simpler
Most accountants, Engineer, Financial analysts, can do there job quite well with basic to middling Excel skills
But the really proficient people have taken there careers to greater heights as using advanced skills simplifys your work and thence allows you to spend more time on understanding and interpreting the results of your labors, rather than just getting to an answer.
Well thats how I see the world, Interested to hear other views.
I am going to answer this with two answers, None and All
No Jobs require you to have advanced Excel skills
Excel is but a tool to an end and being able to use the tool well maybe with "Advanced Excel Skills" as you refer to them, simply means you can do your job more efficiently/simpler
Most accountants, Engineer, Financial analysts, can do there job quite well with basic to middling Excel skills
But the really proficient people have taken there careers to greater heights as using advanced skills simplifys your work and thence allows you to spend more time on understanding and interpreting the results of your labors, rather than just getting to an answer.
Well thats how I see the world, Interested to hear other views.
Somendra Misra
Excel Ninja
@joharmenezes ....
I see it like this...almost all the work in which a computer is involved for accounting, analysis, record maintenance, reporting and other such works( which is now a days almost everywhere, in each and every industry) there are two type of workers "SMART" worker and "HARD" worker. Hard worker will put more time in doing analysis on data with minimal use of excel and Smart worker will use advanced excel skills to do an analysis on it. If you consider your data,it may be a lot, but is is of no use until unless you do a productive analysis on it and the most IMPORTANT to present it to your workforce in an understandable and meaningful manner.
So take a look of your work and differentiate how you are using excel as a tool. That would definitely give you a positive answer to your question.
Regards!
I see it like this...almost all the work in which a computer is involved for accounting, analysis, record maintenance, reporting and other such works( which is now a days almost everywhere, in each and every industry) there are two type of workers "SMART" worker and "HARD" worker. Hard worker will put more time in doing analysis on data with minimal use of excel and Smart worker will use advanced excel skills to do an analysis on it. If you consider your data,it may be a lot, but is is of no use until unless you do a productive analysis on it and the most IMPORTANT to present it to your workforce in an understandable and meaningful manner.
So take a look of your work and differentiate how you are using excel as a tool. That would definitely give you a positive answer to your question.
Regards!
SirJB7
Excel Rōnin
Hi, all!
Having being and being a software developer in many different environments I obviously have to viewpoints:
a) From the suit of a serious software developer and/or IT manager/CIO/etc., Excel isn't absolutely nothing but a tool for end users, either to make their life at work easier with their own built workbooks or to automate several frequently processes. No way to think on holding and supporting a real application that might be mission or business critical.
b) From the role of consultant, Excel is an amazing tool for giving users not only the tools but the quick developed applications that otherwise they'll have to wait -sometimes endlessly- from a) structure, with which you can do almost everything you imagine. Even holding and supporting a real application that might be mission or business critical.
Why such a different approach, almost opposite? Well, nothing's black and white only, there's always a wider or narrower range of intermediate shades.
A cold-blooded and impassive but not for that less true answer is this:
- As a consultant, I'm paid for giving advices, to present different options with pros&cons for each and sometimes to point out my first choice or recommendation. I do jobs with Excel, Office, VB.NET, SQL(s), web, and the Excel scope applies to every other ones. I analyze the feasibility, propose one or many alternatives, always taking care of clearly specifying advantages and risks, and the it's the user who decides which to choose, either by himself of with IT or direction participation.
- As an IT guy, I'm paid to be responsible not only for the developments required by users but for the security, integrity, availability, etc. and specially for any contingency that may happen. I'm an insider, who should balance my not infinite but indeed never enough resources between in-house IT jobs, in-house user jobs, outsourcing or third-party providers.
There're 2 absolutely different approaches that depend on the responsibility of each actor and what he's paid for.
From my personal point of view, Excel is wow, but I don't rely on it so widely as people do.
Regards!
Having being and being a software developer in many different environments I obviously have to viewpoints:
a) From the suit of a serious software developer and/or IT manager/CIO/etc., Excel isn't absolutely nothing but a tool for end users, either to make their life at work easier with their own built workbooks or to automate several frequently processes. No way to think on holding and supporting a real application that might be mission or business critical.
b) From the role of consultant, Excel is an amazing tool for giving users not only the tools but the quick developed applications that otherwise they'll have to wait -sometimes endlessly- from a) structure, with which you can do almost everything you imagine. Even holding and supporting a real application that might be mission or business critical.
Why such a different approach, almost opposite? Well, nothing's black and white only, there's always a wider or narrower range of intermediate shades.
A cold-blooded and impassive but not for that less true answer is this:
- As a consultant, I'm paid for giving advices, to present different options with pros&cons for each and sometimes to point out my first choice or recommendation. I do jobs with Excel, Office, VB.NET, SQL(s), web, and the Excel scope applies to every other ones. I analyze the feasibility, propose one or many alternatives, always taking care of clearly specifying advantages and risks, and the it's the user who decides which to choose, either by himself of with IT or direction participation.
- As an IT guy, I'm paid to be responsible not only for the developments required by users but for the security, integrity, availability, etc. and specially for any contingency that may happen. I'm an insider, who should balance my not infinite but indeed never enough resources between in-house IT jobs, in-house user jobs, outsourcing or third-party providers.
There're 2 absolutely different approaches that depend on the responsibility of each actor and what he's paid for.
From my personal point of view, Excel is wow, but I don't rely on it so widely as people do.
Regards!
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Sajan
Excel Ninja
Hi,
The definition of what is considered Advanced Excel might vary from person to person. For example, I consider VBA programming pretty basic, while many formulas require more thought. I think another way to look at usage is the degree to which Excel is used in a situation, and what type of decisions they are able to make from the Excel models.
In many organizations, most report analysts utilize Excel to create various ad hoc reports, or to supplement an enterprise reporting solution.
I have also seen investment managers (dealing with stocks, bonds, etc.) and their support personnel creating sophisticated models of their portfolios in Excel. Most of the time, I have seen them creating "what if" models in Excel, which when finalized gets modeled in their investment applications.
I have seen accounting and finance folks create sophisticated models in Excel that keep track of a department's/business unit's finances (tracking budgets, forecasts and actual expenses).
I am sure there are many more use cases for extensive, sophisticated models in Excel. However, it is not Excel that makes the models sophisticated, but that Excel is being used to support a complex business operation or need.
While knowledge of Excel is certainly a "must have", I would encourage you to develop business domain knowledge (in accounting, finance, engineering, etc.) and then look for ways to incorporate Excel (if it fits naturally).
Cheers,
Sajan.
The definition of what is considered Advanced Excel might vary from person to person. For example, I consider VBA programming pretty basic, while many formulas require more thought. I think another way to look at usage is the degree to which Excel is used in a situation, and what type of decisions they are able to make from the Excel models.
In many organizations, most report analysts utilize Excel to create various ad hoc reports, or to supplement an enterprise reporting solution.
I have also seen investment managers (dealing with stocks, bonds, etc.) and their support personnel creating sophisticated models of their portfolios in Excel. Most of the time, I have seen them creating "what if" models in Excel, which when finalized gets modeled in their investment applications.
I have seen accounting and finance folks create sophisticated models in Excel that keep track of a department's/business unit's finances (tracking budgets, forecasts and actual expenses).
I am sure there are many more use cases for extensive, sophisticated models in Excel. However, it is not Excel that makes the models sophisticated, but that Excel is being used to support a complex business operation or need.
While knowledge of Excel is certainly a "must have", I would encourage you to develop business domain knowledge (in accounting, finance, engineering, etc.) and then look for ways to incorporate Excel (if it fits naturally).
Cheers,
Sajan.
ThrottleWorks
Excel Ninja
@SirJB7 & @Sajan thanks a lot for your inputs. It will help us a lot.
@joharmenezes, please check the below link.
http://forum.chandoo.org/threads/si...is-welcome-regarding-expertise-in-excel.5306/
Thought I do not claim to know the entire picture, I would like to ad 1 point here.
The place where I live (Pune - India), it will give you a certain advantage in job if you know excel well. The most important thing is you have to be good in your domain, it may be Finance, Auto, Banking and so on.
If you are good in your domain then only it will help you to excute your excel skills.
About how the core excel jobs works here, I will give some details shortly.
Have a nice day ahead.
@joharmenezes, please check the below link.
http://forum.chandoo.org/threads/si...is-welcome-regarding-expertise-in-excel.5306/
Thought I do not claim to know the entire picture, I would like to ad 1 point here.
The place where I live (Pune - India), it will give you a certain advantage in job if you know excel well. The most important thing is you have to be good in your domain, it may be Finance, Auto, Banking and so on.
If you are good in your domain then only it will help you to excute your excel skills.
About how the core excel jobs works here, I will give some details shortly.
Have a nice day ahead.
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tobediff
New Member
@joharmenezes
I think @Hui has the right idea. I'm not sure if Excel is required for many jobs, and it seems that often times if you are tested for Excel skills during the interview process the tests are not very advanced. (See this Chandoo article for some great discussion on that -> http://chandoo.org/wp/2013/09/27/best-excel-interview-questions/)
I personally was given an Excel test that consisted of vlookup and Pivot tables during my last interview.
On the other hand, once you get into your job and find out exactly what your role is, there are always opportunities to learn Excel and improve the tools that you use. My department handles collections, so we have to send out a large number of emails based on Excel data. A few hours of macro scripting has saved me days of time copy-pasting the emails we send out almost daily.
I think @Hui has the right idea. I'm not sure if Excel is required for many jobs, and it seems that often times if you are tested for Excel skills during the interview process the tests are not very advanced. (See this Chandoo article for some great discussion on that -> http://chandoo.org/wp/2013/09/27/best-excel-interview-questions/)
I personally was given an Excel test that consisted of vlookup and Pivot tables during my last interview.
On the other hand, once you get into your job and find out exactly what your role is, there are always opportunities to learn Excel and improve the tools that you use. My department handles collections, so we have to send out a large number of emails based on Excel data. A few hours of macro scripting has saved me days of time copy-pasting the emails we send out almost daily.
Wilco()
Member
I think for all jobs what is vital is how you deal with people. Excel is a tool, kind of secondary to how you act socially. You may be a wizard with excel, but if you cannot sell yourself as such it does not matter how good you really are.
But if you can see and sell your Excel Wizardry as a 'strong point' (translate it how it will help their business) than it will work magic.
But if you can see and sell your Excel Wizardry as a 'strong point' (translate it how it will help their business) than it will work magic.
juanito
Member
Interesting thread!
I'd say that in many front-end jobs, advanced Excel skills (and Sajan is correct: there's no real consensus around what that means) are a Big Plus.
But then, so are a lot of other things!
Knowing your field is pretty necessary. Yet in the long run, "soft" skills - "how" more than "what" - are the most important. Building bridges, thinking strategically, picking up dropped balls, disrupting ingrained habits - that's what really counts.
There's one thing that I notice again and again in Large Organizations. There's a no-man's-land between the Hard IT stuff and the other stuff that users really need too but nobody gives them - sort of between SirJB7's a) and b). Of course you have to have the soft skills to see that no-man's-land, to know what to do in it and to want to... but Excel can help you execute: a Very Big Plus.
- Juanito
I'd say that in many front-end jobs, advanced Excel skills (and Sajan is correct: there's no real consensus around what that means) are a Big Plus.
But then, so are a lot of other things!
Knowing your field is pretty necessary. Yet in the long run, "soft" skills - "how" more than "what" - are the most important. Building bridges, thinking strategically, picking up dropped balls, disrupting ingrained habits - that's what really counts.
There's one thing that I notice again and again in Large Organizations. There's a no-man's-land between the Hard IT stuff and the other stuff that users really need too but nobody gives them - sort of between SirJB7's a) and b). Of course you have to have the soft skills to see that no-man's-land, to know what to do in it and to want to... but Excel can help you execute: a Very Big Plus.
- Juanito
SirJB7
Excel Rōnin
Hi, juanito!
About the 1st quote, any tool (technology, organizational, relationship,... related) helps adding you a differential ability that let you follow better Darwin's motto (that of the adaptation). In corps where data analyzing is critical, Excel it's one of the best -and easy to acquire- tools.
2nd quote: more important of course, like Peter Drucker said about ideal management is to do the right things and not things right.
3rd: the no-man's-land is always a flaw in the enterprise organization structure. If that field is to be sowed and harvested, then the direction is blind, you'd better focus on switching off the organization. If that field isn't critical but might be promissory, then the user who takes care of it should be protected and aided by and with IT resources, just negotiating between heads of IT & user area (if it reaches the steering committee, well then why not changing CIO and CUO (chief user-section officer), they don't serve for their jobs). If it's only a matter of user sector importance, then there is the only case where the CUO should be left alone with the new activities, as long as they don't impact negatively in the usual operation (IT resources are highly expensive, usually fully or over occupied, and are not to be distracted on non mission critical things).
If you ask me, I'm more comfortable in the land of grays, more closer to a consultant than to a CIO, it's much more healthy and unless there's a very high salary in the middle, it isn't worth the pain... to keep on for years and years in the IT internal side.
Regards!
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juanito
Member
Very valuable insights, SirJB7, thank you for sharing them. I would only add that what is critical and non-critical is also a grey area to some extent: enterprise leaders must decide how to allocate resources of course, but effective leaders will also listen. IT is not always sufficiently alert to this and can tend to just go along with top-down definitions of what is critical rather than contributing actively to the debate.
Great opportunities await organisations that encourage working across the standard (and to some extent a necessary evil) organisational hierarchies/silos... and they also await individuals who identify these opportunities and strive to achieve them. Different organisational cultures will either encourage or stifle such initiatives.
Those approaching these areas from the front-end (non-IT) perspective (like Finance as in my case) may often find that acquiring advanced Excel skills can help them make a big enough impact, early enough and with little or no additional resource, to get the value of their idea noticed and for it to gain sufficient political traction to bring in the "big guns" from IT and so forth. I have never seen an iniative of that nature originate from IT... but that is my experience and I would welcome counterexamples from other forum readers.
(Note to ninjas: If we want to pursue this conversation, should we open a new thread?)
- Juanito
Great opportunities await organisations that encourage working across the standard (and to some extent a necessary evil) organisational hierarchies/silos... and they also await individuals who identify these opportunities and strive to achieve them. Different organisational cultures will either encourage or stifle such initiatives.
Those approaching these areas from the front-end (non-IT) perspective (like Finance as in my case) may often find that acquiring advanced Excel skills can help them make a big enough impact, early enough and with little or no additional resource, to get the value of their idea noticed and for it to gain sufficient political traction to bring in the "big guns" from IT and so forth. I have never seen an iniative of that nature originate from IT... but that is my experience and I would welcome counterexamples from other forum readers.
(Note to ninjas: If we want to pursue this conversation, should we open a new thread?)
- Juanito